Man you're Crusader 5. People are there for a reason. Why you bother putting it on beh score ? If you grind mmr there will be less and less such people. I had none of these for last 500 games at least.
I remember when my friend lent me his Archon 5 acc and those people holy cow. Most of the time people there focus 80% of their attention not on whats going on in the game and their playstyle, but on their own teammates. The biggest clowns are supports. They dont know how to play their role properly but they are first to ping-spam their cores when they make 1 tiny mistake like missing cs or a spell.
Games on Crus are 100% winnable even with a burden like that if you do your job properly and just insta mute toxic people. Just insta mute any kind of stupid discussion. People dont realize how disturbing chatting is or paying attention to someone's toxic behaviour. Just let it be and move on. We all experience that sometimes.
3k games sub 50% win rate, its ok, ur low skill scrub and so is everyone around you, embrace it and play dota for fun, make channel like mid or meepo and play turbos with your friends with meme builds.
Ok lets see your games. First of all I dont know how can you lose with Clinkz on Crusader. Invi = invincibility.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5532950836
- Clinkz, I dunno what position were you playing but having 117 cs on 38 minute is probably running in circles most of the time doing nothing considering your very low dmg. What were you doing in this game ??
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5531723444
- Again Clinkz. This time in 37 min game you have ... 1 cs more :D (118) lmao. And you played mid ? Usually Clinkz players with such a low cs number are like 22:5 in kill-death ratio roamin the map with highest hero dmg. You hero dmg is one of the lowest. WHAT WERE YOU DOING AGAIN? Can you tell me ?
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5530864556
- PL game. Ok here you have much better cs but your score is god damn awful considering the picks they have. You can dodge almost every spell they have. You can dispel Pugna spells, you can dodge Omnislash, you just had to care for RP. Maybe Jugg was a smurf I dunno.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5530821324
- Morphling. Here you won the game but still you CS is super low for this hero. You have items, though again you have quite low hero dmg. How is that possible ? You seem to play too passively.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5529145332
- where is your bkb ? They deal mostly magic dmg and they have vessel. CS and dmg low again.
To summarize. You seem to have completely no idea what to do to win games. You just go with the game and thats it. You cant last hit for sure. You have probably huge problems with laning and how to lane and on top of that you play pos 1-2. :D Why you insist on playing cores when you suck at them ? Play supports and learn it. You probably waste so much time running around doing nothing. Also you dont seem to harass your enemies at all, especially with Clinkz who has HUGE range with huge dmg for almost no mana.
Besides stop playing Morphling - he is too complex for you. Learn basics first.
Lol I have no idea how this discussion turned into an analysis of my skills in crusader 5. Just wanted to get some sharing on the weird reasons why people throw. Mostly people fed arguing about who gets the lanes...I just found the two I ran into yesterday with super weird reasons for throwing.
It's not a complaint about why I'm losing with throwers on the game...I specifically mentioned Pudge then went on to play really well and basically won us the game. But I guess bashing people is too hard to pass up...regardless of what they actually meant to say.
Man, get higher mmr and your problem with throwers will not exist. Your shithole bracket is the reason you get such quality of teammates. I dunno what can I say more so you can understand that your performance is strictly connected with your problem. If you play bad, you will play with people at your level. And people on Crus-Archon are usually people with low mentality.
Man, get higher mmr and your problem with throwers will not exist^ LMAO yea right at what bracket is that, 7k+ maybe, and even then its not like high MMR players are not subhumans.
Not ordinary "throwers" but intentional throwers (intentional toxic behaviour on 10k beh score). What we are talking about in this thread from start ?
I remember the time when Coockie called me an idiot from fairyland when I said that behaviour score exists but its hidden and it influences individual game quality. (just a digression)
Behavior score literally exists since the dawn of time, you could check it in console, it was hidden in a sense it was not displayed in plain sight like now, but many people knew it. Cockie is a fucking mouth breather anyways who cares what he says.
This is just a thread to share about the weirdest reasons for feeding you came across. I don't meet throwers all the time...rarely actually and it happens on both teams. But both of those I met in one day were super weird.....come on..feeding cos someone won't lend u a set????? and not knowing how ban works and thinking your teammate did it halfway through the hero picking stage.... so I just thought I'd share...it was pretty funny reasons and I laughed thinking about it after awhile although it was frustrating at first.
That's all man. And thanks for your analysis about my performance but let me repeat once again that this is not a post blaming losses on someone throwing. AND I REPEAT AGAIN THAT I DID PUT IN THE EXAMPLE OF THE GAME WE WON WITH A THROWER THAT WENT ON TO PLAY WELL. I have a pretty clear idea about how much I suck and stuff and how much I need to improve...I got dotaplus, so I just compare my average gpm and xpm and kills and lhs and stuff to the people at my bracket...and the people at higher brackets. If the gpm is slightly higher or lower than the people at my bracket then I try to work on that...same with lhs and stuff. And I know how far I fall short compared to someone at divine...all i need to do is press the divine button and I can see my avg GPm for xxx hero is 40-50 lower than someone at divine.
I can't comment what it's like at higher mmr cos I never been there...but from what some of the immortals post here, throwing and stuff is also pretty common up there. So if you have any really funny ones do post them here.
You didint write it clear enough, thats why Kabir's booster understood it the same as I did - as whining about teamates. Who cares about some low mentals that didint get their desired pick ? They are not worth the forum space, with all respect.
Lighten up man, it's a forum. If people can waste so much energy just for the chance to bash someone up, research their game history and stuff....surely they can summon the energy up for some laughs to share. Right? The world could do with some laughs man...surely that's gotta be more worthy of forum space than all this pent up negative energy. With all due respect of course.
@Lex nice analyse. I had a game today with Void and my enemy was Spec. late game I chrono on him and died attacking him!! :/
how can that be possible? I know how spec's spells work and I know BKB wouldnt save me so I just bought attacking Items.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5567165924
I dont wanna mention that, but our Axe and Pugna were feeding like shit since start. I could kill everyone but spec and Ember(Aeon). so what should I have done maybe..?
there was another game: https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5567121887
I was AM, my allies feeding like shit and my Sup (viper) was farming in my lane!! so I started jungling since min 9 and u know AM sucks at jungle first-game but anyway I wanna ask if I could do anything in such game? (when allies feed constantly like they get 1 kill and die twice to cores and I am too poor in first minutes to help them!) I think I should've afk in base and wait for enemy to finish
stay out of people shit
u dont know how much you people hurting my brain, but at the end of the day im the crazy one cause i care.
99% of people acting like animals, if u wanna kill them all, well, i can control the drones. sign me up
@Warcraft
I dont have time to watch the game so I may be mistaken. Void game - certainly you should have had more last hits. Generally you should aim for min x 10 cs on any hero that can flash farm. For void maybe less, but it should be around 350 or more on 40 min mark, so you should have at least 100 cs more in that game. In an easy game you should have 400 or more cs on 40 min mark. (if your hero can flash farm). The reason for that is probably because you went MOM and then maelstrom, so you run around with almost no HP.
When it comes to itemisation. Bkb in this game 100%. Satanic vs Spec is also very good. Manta was core here to dispel Chains and Track. Im not a fan of mom on void if you are not going for Butterfly + Satanic disassamble. You could go for either BF in this game (what I would do) since you had very easy matchup vs LS and BH or for Manta, Diffu, BKB and keep the tempo vs 3 good late game heros (Ember, Spectre, LS). But you need team to finish the game early, what on lower brackets doesnt work. So I would just go for BF and get items that you need.
When it comes to talents, you need sustain in such matchup so I would probably go for -1.75 sec cd on timewalk.
AM game - you should not have picked antimage here in the first place. What for ? Especially if you have Viper support that is newbie and takes your farm. Void here would be nice or something else. Also when you see undying - buy a stick.
Generall recommend ? Focus on every single cs you can take on lane without taking too much harass. You probably miss a ton of cs so work on that and bam... you're Ancient player.
I mean.
Your cs is not there.
If crusader, u can easily 1v5 and win.
Just ward yourself and focus on CS.
30 mins with that kind of cs is just meh.
Don't join bad fights even if your teammate spam ping you.
Just mute them. End of story.
^ See OP ? Everyone is understanding your question differently than you thought you asked.
not me, obviously he is talking about behavior score and its relation to game quality.
and u are relating it to mmr, which is true, only apes and mentals will stuck at these mmrs for their life, which means even 10k behavior ones are fucking animals.
@Lex, you know in bracket that I ply, first 2 picks are for pos 5,4 then pos 3,1 then pos 2 picks. that's a common draft
so in AM game, I just saw them have Butcher and LION and us Viper , Shaman so I kinda guessed that AM can be a good choice.
how tf I could know they pick Undyng -_-
that's a usual problem in draft for pos 1 heroes. we kinda pick a hero and hope they don't pick an anti hero same time.
and about the talents : until now , I though anyone who prefer "-1.75 sec timewalk" to "+40 attack speed" is a fuckin moron but seems like it may work sometimes..
In the first scenario IDK what the fuck is wrong with the guy actually he probably has a very bad day so that's okay. I wouldn't do this for such a shitty reason though even in my worst fucking days. Feeding because no one gave you his sets come on. He probably just was feeling like feeding and now had a stupid reason which is understandable.
In the second scenario honestly i would've ruined the shit out of the game as well just let me play my own fucking game. If you don't like what people pick and can't adapt to people's play styles and decision making then just stop playing this game or play with a team. If you think you're the best in a certain role then play that role instead of crying out loud. And if you think you're better than your team in each and every role. Then either find a team to play with or stop playing or adapt.
This 2 matches for example https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5563531934 and https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5565089458. We had straight up shit picks i knew we're gonna lose before it had even begun but it's okay. You sometimes win and you sometimes lose. If they wanna go Sky mid that's all good. I'm not gonna ignore it i might suggest something else but at the end of the day that's the lane, the role and the hero he wants to play. And it's just a game.
Wow all the fucking gaslighting from people who dont know what crusader games are like in this thread.
Invi = invincibility.
No it isnt. Crusader morons absolutely tunnel vision when they see Riki or Clinkz on the other team. These heros scare the fuck out of them and they obsess over buying dust and wards and exposing invis heros to the point where it undermines their own game.
Morphling - he is too complex for you
Morphling is a fucking easy hero that anyone with half a brain cell can play
Man, get higher mmr and your problem with throwers will not exist. Your shithole bracket is the reason you get such quality of teammates.
This is complete and utter horseshit, throwers do not dissappear. You will get fucking feeders and assholes in every bracket all the way to the top. I have seen Divine/Immortal players run down mid the same way they do in 3k games.
ANYWAY - As for reasons why people throw. I can tell you cause I do it all the fucking time.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5566684826 Heres a game where I purposefully went afk within the first 5 minutes because some animal picked alchemist in turbo and every lane was lost basically immediately so I didnt see why I should bother wasting my time when my team is full of imbeciles.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5555832996 - This game I said pos 3 then some stupid gyro went to my lane, fed am 3 times and stole my farm before being abusive toward me.
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5542758870 - I won mid roll and that Tiny went mid and started tossing me into the Weaver
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/5530028148 - Went afk cause I have 2 spastics in my offlane who fed 20 kills to a PA in the first 10m
@Warcraft
You have to adapt. You picked, they counter you a bit but not that much, you should have got an early stick thats for sure. I would just pick something else like Slark when I saw Pudge Lion. But thats just me.
Talents on any hero are situational. Ofc 95% of the time you will pick +40 AS but vs their draft and your lack of sustain items you should have tried to balance it with a talent. I would just pick different items and talent would not matter much.
@Parma
Read the fuckin whole discussion. We were talking about 10 k beh score, not your animal behaviour. Ofc you will run into intentional throwers frequently because of your own behaviour.
Morphling is one of the most complex hero to play on a good level. What you dont understand ? Anyone can play him yes. But Ive seen a few Morphlings doing magic with his ultimate and shifts.
With this invincibility, it was just a joke gosh.
@ParmaRead the fuckin whole discussion. We were talking about 10 k beh score, not your animal behaviour. Its you that encounter such behaviour frequently because you are weak minded yourself.
I have 8.5k behaviour score. You will get retards in every single bracket, in every single behaviour score. If you truly believe there are conditions that enable you to avoid bad behaviour in dota then you are a fucking clown
@parmaviolets
Like you know anything about DOTA Archon turbo player.
invisibility is invincibility if used correctly, Riki has 2 long range blinks, a disjoint, and builds dispels. With right positioning no 2k player will kill him. Clinkz is hasted, Invisible, 4k hp hero. The way you go in and out of fights with Hex/BKB there is no way anyone catches you even with 10 dusts, not to mention the retarded way people farm in low brackets means he will have multiple pick offs and get fat to the point where he literally just man fights multiple heroes.
Morphling in comparisson to other heroes is far from "fucking easy" .
Wtf does your experience have to do with DOTA in any way or form, its like talking about people ruining your artifact games, ofc people pick stupid shit in turbo its used for nothing but cavern, hero challenges, behavior score farming.
^Are you brain damaged? You think i have played turbo exclusively since the dawn of time or what? I do have thousands of games of regular dota you moron. If you havent played crusader games then shut the fuck up and stop pretending like you know how their stupid minds work when they see invis heros on the other team. I actually used to like it if I picked core, and someone picked clinkz mid or riki offlane cause I know its a free win because the other team are literally going to try so hard to counter the invis that they forget to deal with our pos 1. In Archon/Legend brackets there are games where the entire map gets blanketed by sentries if you have an invis hero, so stop pretending like you know shit about games that you dont play thanks.
well, now we can see in practice how an animal who stuck at low mmr for her life behaves, not even in the game, on fucking internet :))
they know everything, thats why u should play properly and if u do a mistake, "gg go next"
Sure crusaders are better at scouting invis heroes then immortals, fuck off braindead window licker.
Sure crusaders are better at scouting invis heroes then immortals, fuck off braindead window licker.
Are you schizophrenic? Hallucinating things? Where did I write that? I cant seem to find it anywhere? Lets continue to pretend, seems you have a very vivid imagination.
Damn you sure have a way of arguing, you just imagine things in your head and wait for people to read your mind or something. The guy said Invisibility is invincibility, and used correctly that is true in majority of low MMR games. Then you go on a rant how Crusaders are tunnel visioned on revealing invis heroes while undermining their game, we know low skill idiots can have brown boots and 20 sentries at 30 min, it doesn't contradict his argument tho.
Behavior score is weird now. With the playerbase not as large as before, the matchmaking algorithm has to expand its range to accommodate and keep queue times “low”
Methods of throwing:
-running down mid(very basic)
-destroying items
-blocking camps
-afk jungling
-buying wards and not placing
-allchatting positions, items
The point being that invsibility isnt invincibility in 'low skill' mmr games. Lets be real for a second, in Herald and maybe Guardian agreed. But Crusaders generally understand what they are doing even if they are braindead creatures. They know to reveal invis, they know to buy dust, they feel threatened by invis heros and they know on paper how to counter these heros. If you can play Clinkz like a 3 or 4k in low mmr then congrats, free win. Otherwise you will just feed into enemy vision like any other hero, there is a reason Riki only has a 51% winrate in dog brackets. Both Clinkz and Riki perform best in Archon/Legend where the player is good enough to have a grasp on map awareness and map control. In these brackets people still are not good enough to counter invis like they would at immortal, but they are good enough to avoid being countered if you understand me. In low skill games, people who pick Clinkz and Riki are so bad at the game they dont know how to avoid being countered by reveals. Invisibility = Invincibility is a huge trap for bad players.
The way Clinkz works even in Immortal games if its not very high rank is that once you take some outer towers, its really easy to pick people off if you don't take the most obvious routes to enemy side of the map. In games where you are ahead and have some kind of vision set up supports will relentlessly feed by trying to de ward or place their sentries. I'm not arguing Crusaders don't know what a dust or sentry does, but that they don't know how to utilize them before they are already dead and Clinkz is on his merry way.
@parmaviolets Imagine being an ArchonDog and calling Crusaders "Moron".. xD girl u are so close to Crusader
I am guardianV and I draft with Crusaders and barely they spend money on wards and dust (they think it's a waste of money! xD)
"smoke item" has no meaning for them and there are games enemy has Techies and I beg my sups to buy gem at min 45 but no one does!
that's why one of forum guys said : "Spam Techies and reach Ancient" yeah that is possible cause brainless ppl in these brackets.
and they don't even know where to ward! imagine enemy pushin us under 2nd tower and my sup dies warding their jungle!
like everygame I see my sups feeding cause they leave too far for wards.
The problem is not vision but the fact that they run with brown boots min 15. No force, no glimmer/ghost. Saving money for precious scepter. :p
Clinkz doesnt care that much about reveal, but a lot of lockdown and armor.
Don't expect people to throw less in higher mmr. In 4-5k mmr there're a lot of throwers there and even in 5-6k+ you'll meet a lot of boosters, smurfs on the way
lex is right about clinkz. He uses invisibility to gank people much like a smoke but obviously worse. This is why it is way more important for supports on the clinkz's team to buy sentry to deward path openings. He doesnt care if once he starts attacking people will sentry that area or dust him he cares if people are able to track his movement. Once he reveals himself he doesnt care if he is dusted or whatever. Root is extremely painful for him as is people with glimmers and force staff and euls.
Also people are wrong about dust and sentry in lower bracket. The biggest reason why you think there are more detection in high bracket is that when they use it it will usually result in a kill. Thus giving everyone gold and positive reinforcement to buy another one. Where as in lower bracket with people stacking stuns etc or late dusting and not getting the kill resulting them wasting money on it and making themselves weaker. Often supports buy way too much detection and make it so they are so weak they constantly give enemy opportunity to kill them making you think you need more detection when the simple fact is if the supports were stronger there will be less fights and thus needing less detection.
Honestly to why people throw and feed. In most cases they are having a bad day or carrying negative emotions from the game before. Most games people play are zombie mode games where they just playing not cuz they are enjoying but playing cuz it is something to waste time on. Sometimes a grief by teammate or an annoying remark is just the last straw on the camel back and they just go whatever and ruin the game.
Honestly, A lot of this depends. In Crusader, Archon, Legend games. Detection will not be bought unless the person playing actually cares about supporting. Sometimes you get people that belong in low priority, don't speak your language or only one language that usually not English in English speaking servers or are only there because of autofill. These people will not buy vision.
Do you have intentional throwers in higher mmr? Of course, you're an idiot to not think so. is there the same amount of throwers? From a 10k behavior score perspective, probably not. Because usually players at a higher mmr care about winning/mmr and have already gone through the phase of toxicity to ignore most of it. But their expectations for others players to play their role is higher and they can throw a fit if these expectations aren't met. I've even seen 8k players have Qops that lose to Pango mid or something and destroy their items near rosh pit and tell them to push to end. People don't stop breaking just because their mmr is high.
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Oh man I just had to get this off my chest....super frustrating. I've met loads of people who throw and feed but the 2 I encountered yesterday were the weirdest ever. Btw I won one and lost the other..
1. Pudge on my team. During hero picking stage, he asked if anyone had a nice set they could borrow him. Swap the hero, and then when the game starts swap back again, so he ends up with a nice pudge set. No one answered him...so when game starts...he said ok..I'm gonna feed and went down mid and fed twice, then camped there. After that he played really well though and kinda won us the game. Still the first 10 mins with him were seriously demotivating. Other team asked why he's feeding...and I replied..'cos he's too poor to afford a set..and got angry cos no one would lend him one'.
2. Later in the day...again during hero picking stage. Offlane proceeds to highlight that he wants to pick zeus. Support pugna goes 'gg idiot offlane zeus'. Cue arguments about why offlane zeus is ok. When his turn comes, he proceeds to pick zeus, but the other team picks zeus too and it gets banned. He proceeds to pick puck and starts blaming pugna for banning (OMG) his zeus. Game starts and pugna dcs...Puck keeps unpausing...then planting wards and telling the other team to deward for the money. We lost this one.
Twice in one day and I have 10k BHS. I can only imagine what it's like to be 5k BHS.